tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post5034210584370349358..comments2024-03-27T12:58:00.592-07:00Comments on Snowbrush: From the heartSnowbrushhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comBlogger27125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-46607778224853261122009-04-26T05:04:00.000-07:002009-04-26T05:04:00.000-07:00"Parts of the Bible, I abhor; other parts touch me..."Parts of the Bible, I abhor; other parts touch me down deep. Even when I don’t believe the Bible’s words, I cannot escape its power."<br /><br />Wow, wow, wow. I just keep getting drawn back to this quote. Do you feel that way about any other books??<br /><br />I could start commenting on all the interesting things in this post but I'm not sure that I've got enough time. :) Definitely intriuging...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-21081811805517842962009-04-18T08:55:00.000-07:002009-04-18T08:55:00.000-07:00"I still don't get your interest in Sunday school...."I still don't get your interest in Sunday school."<br /><br />I'm honored by your interest. You are one of only two people who have gone through the old tomes, so to speak to learn more about me, and both have done so this week.<br /><br />I did think about your question some more after I last wrote, and can add somewhat to your reading. There is a friendship making element in church for me. Maybe you've read about my recent shoulder surgery, my wife going out of town, and me being unable to exercise our two dogs during her absence. A couple who I met at the Congregationalist Church have come over every day, rain or shine, and taken the dogs for an hour long walk. These people know that I'm not a Christian; they know that I will never join their church; and they don't care. I don't have a lot of opportunities to meet new people (esp intelligent new people who think about things profoundly), and church is one. Most of the others I could attend would be dedicated to some special interest, and I have few of those.<br /><br />"Maybe there is a fear that if I expressed my true beliefs there( or rather lack thereof) I might be stoned."<br /><br />At First Christian where I've been going off-and-on lately, there are two Sunday school classes. The first is composed of older people and is quite liberal overall. The second is composed of young middle aged (if that makes sense) and is more traditional. I'm starting to feel rather silly in the second class because the people are clearly there to reinforce their beliefs rather than to examine them and the Bible openly. So, there is something to what you say. People don't so much get mad as they just start to look at me as if to ask, "Why in the hell are you here?" When that happens, I wonder too. But it doesn't always happen.<br /><br />The local Quaker meeting accepts atheists into membership. You can in no way say that it is even distinctly Christian, and I think you might begin to see more of the old mainstream churches going in that direction. Once a church opens its arms to everyone, well, if they mean it, they have to include people of all beliefs.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-51274051838833465752009-04-18T05:21:00.000-07:002009-04-18T05:21:00.000-07:00As I read this post, at nearly every paragraph, I ...As I read this post, at nearly every paragraph, I thought of something to comment on, but decided to use one of the last thoughts you expressed:<br />You said, "I grew up believing that sinners and black people,,,, were inherently stupid, filthy, immoral, and germy." <br /><br />This seems to be a universal response to other cultures or races. In "Gold Mountain" a woman traces her Chinese family from the time her great-great grandfather became a herbalist for Chinese railroad workers, when the Chinese didn't trust western medicine and thought white men were dirty. Meanwhile, the Chinese were considered by the whites as unclean. In Henry Louis Gates' memoir "Colored People" his mother thought whites were dirty, whereas whites thought blacks were dirty. A few years ago at work a friend and I were discussing the Iraq war over lunch (we were against it) when a coworker at another table piped up to tell us that the Iraqi people were such filthy scum that they actually ate excrement. She was dead serious. Some Arabs probably say the same about us. These stereotypical ideas are born from ignorance, fear, and hate and seem to be universal.<br /><br />I still don't get your interest in Sunday school. I read about religion and non-religion all the time, but I never have the desire to go to Sunday school. Maybe there is a fear that if I expressed my true beliefs there( or rather lack thereof) I might be stoned. Those religious types in the Bible were ready to stone anyone who didn't agree with them, on God's orders, of course..C Woodshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13053858627632648020noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-77890730741754367052009-04-08T21:40:00.000-07:002009-04-08T21:40:00.000-07:00Right: Technology is amazing when it works, and ut...Right: Technology is amazing when it works, and utterly horrid when it doesn't.<BR/><BR/>The blog link again: <A>http://desertepiphanies.blogspot.com/</A><BR/><BR/>The story link again: <A>http://desertepiphanies.blogspot.com/2009/02/bible-in-its-context.html</A><BR/><BR/>If neither of those work, send me you e-mail address, and I’ll e-mail my post to you.Rob-bearhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00171692478879522588noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-10638819838500391052009-04-08T09:55:00.000-07:002009-04-08T09:55:00.000-07:00Rob-bear, I am very sorry that you've been ill, an...Rob-bear, I am very sorry that you've been ill, and I hope you are bushy-tailed real soon. I still can't get that link to work. Maybe if you just give me the publication date, I can run it down from there.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-77065464565385744292009-04-08T03:09:00.000-07:002009-04-08T03:09:00.000-07:00Sorry to be so slow in responding to your comment....Sorry to be so slow in responding to your comment. I have some fairly significant health issues, and they've been dragging me down recently.<BR/><BR/>I'm honestly not sure where to begin in replying to your very extensive comment. I understand something of what you've been through -- emphasis on the word "something."<BR/><BR/>The one thing I might suggest is in an old post of mine. <A>http://desertepiphanies.blogspot.com/2009/02/bible-in-its context.html</A> You may have already discovered that.<BR/><BR/>I wish you peace and joy.Rob-bearhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00171692478879522588noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-79721551105934142612009-03-31T00:04:00.000-07:002009-03-31T00:04:00.000-07:00P.S. The page link didn't work, although I reached...P.S. The page link didn't work, although I reached the blog itself.<BR/><BR/> http://desertepiphanies.blogspot.com/2009/02/bible-in-its context.htmlSnowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-55253427918812383622009-03-31T00:01:00.000-07:002009-03-31T00:01:00.000-07:00"I'm a little puzzled about why you find the study..."I'm a little puzzled about why you find the study of religion interesting."<BR/><BR/>It's a deeper question than I can fully answer. Early religious training, temperament, a desire for greater guidance than my equals (i.e. other people) can provide.<BR/><BR/>"...the old Celtic notion of the two books of revelation -- the big book (the Universe, Creation) and the small book (the Bible)."<BR/><BR/>I wonder what the small book was prior to the Bibl, if there was one? Masonry (I am a Mason) speaks of lesser lights and greater lights, lesser lights being real lights and greater lights being the Bible or some other supposedly holy book.<BR/><BR/>"I don't believe the universe is benevolent."<BR/><BR/>I agree.<BR/><BR/>I will say hi when I visit your epiphanies site. You have read the writings of the early desert fathers, no doubt.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-15868863380669920362009-03-30T23:39:00.000-07:002009-03-30T23:39:00.000-07:00Snowbrush, I appreciate this gutsy post. I'm a lit...Snowbrush, I appreciate this gutsy post. <BR/><BR/>I'm a little puzzled about why you find the study of religion interesting, if it had no relation to who/what you are as a human being. But maybe I'm missing something here. <BR/><BR/>Being a Celt by temperament, I recall the old Celtic notion of the two books of revelation -- the big book (the Universe, Creation) and the small book (the Bible). the Celts thought of God as being alive in all things. I believe the term is "panentheism."<BR/><BR/>I don't believe the universe is benevolent. I believe that it just is. Nature can be beautiful, and also "red in tooth and claw." People can be wonderful; people can be terrible. (i am where I am today because of some horrific dealings with terrible people in a church.)<BR/><BR/>I've been familiar with Clarence Jordan and his work since the 1960s. Great stuff! I have my own notes about the Bible on my "Desert Epiphanies" blog. (http://desertepiphanies.blogspot.com/2009/02/bible-in-its context.html)Rob-bearhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00171692478879522588noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-74259838795552787372009-03-26T11:27:00.000-07:002009-03-26T11:27:00.000-07:00Marion, I too love books, but at sixty, I'm findin...Marion, I too love books, but at sixty, I'm finding that the print in a lot of mine is just too darn little to read comfortably. Funny how I NEVER thought of such an eventuality when I bought them.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-20863003000750023612009-03-25T07:46:00.000-07:002009-03-25T07:46:00.000-07:00i can spell 'believe'by the way. groan...............i can spell 'believe'by the way. groan.............its the keyboard !!!!!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15047696858755347818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-50956960466579708222009-03-24T13:07:00.000-07:002009-03-24T13:07:00.000-07:00Now you've gone and done it... I've been on a self...Now you've gone and done it... I've been on a self-imposed Amazon.com diet and NOW I have GOT to have these Cotton Patch translations. I'm appalled that I haven't heard of them until now! Better late than never, I guess. What a wonderful, uplifting, healing and positive post. Makes me almost want to head back to the Pentecostal church so I can jump a few pews and do some of those fun little dances we used to do. <BR/><BR/>I was born into the Cat'lick religion and then went to an Independent church as a child (as I posted a while back on my blog, whichever church offered the most candy---my sisters and I attended on Sunday mornings so my mother could sleep---she was a bartender), also went to the Baptist, Methodist, Assembly of God, Church of Christ, Pentecostal, Latter Day Saints and the---did I say Methodist? It didn't hurt me at all. In fact, some of my best memories are from attending a little country church where most of the members were "old". (I redefine what "old" is the older I get. LOL!) Your post made me nostalgic for the people and for reading the Psalms, my favorite book of the Bible. I have about 15 translations and now I'm headed to buy more. (I have no less than 15 translation of 'The Tao' also...must be a magic number...)<BR/><BR/>One can never have too many books, especially THE Book, I always say. Thank you for sharing your heart....Blessings---MarionLhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04131364497408446013noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-8981546111354188842009-03-23T16:36:00.000-07:002009-03-23T16:36:00.000-07:00Well, there you go. That's kind of my opinion abou...Well, there you go. That's kind of my opinion about it--God is in all things. The trouble is that this means he is in a lot of really bad things too.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-59240611578260799322009-03-23T15:53:00.000-07:002009-03-23T15:53:00.000-07:00Thanks for your views.I don't at all think that yo...Thanks for your views.<BR/><BR/>I don't at all think that you never listened or doubted that you tried to hear his voice. Not even for a moment do I doubt it.<BR/><BR/>More important to me however is that you heard Joanne's voice and you heard the lady whose husband was leaving her and that you helped to comfort her.<BR/><BR/>That is the only thing that matters to me.<BR/><BR/>Cheers to keeping it real.<BR/><BR/>Renee xoxoxoReneehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11785932958464359112noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-79011622556097674532009-03-23T13:58:00.000-07:002009-03-23T13:58:00.000-07:00Renee, Yes, it is a serious translation that was m...Renee, Yes, it is a serious translation that was made by Vernon Jordan, an ordained Southern Baptist minister, from the original language (Aramaic, I think it was). Vernon Jordan founded an interracial, cooperative, farming community in Georgia, USA, during the 1960s. They endured years of furious persecution including being shot at.<BR/><BR/>I will read your post.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-76370814901442100292009-03-23T12:05:00.000-07:002009-03-23T12:05:00.000-07:00Excellent. Absolutely excellent.You are a wonderf...Excellent. Absolutely excellent.<BR/><BR/>You are a wonderful writer, your words flow effortlessly.<BR/><BR/>That patch work book is that supposed to be a joke or a legitimate version of the bible?<BR/><BR/>We are on the same page, you and I in many ways. If you are up for it check out a blog post I did on March 3rd this year. 'God Versus His Representatives.'<BR/><BR/>Let me know what you think.<BR/><BR/>Renee xoxoxoReneehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11785932958464359112noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-60999602479977871972009-03-22T01:02:00.000-07:002009-03-22T01:02:00.000-07:00i beleive but find it hard to pin down exactly wha...i beleive but find it hard to pin down exactly what.<BR/>i beleive in cycles, nature and that energies effect different people in different ways.<BR/>i belive in personal power to create change, that we are born with a plan and that faith and gratitude are the keys to happiness.<BR/>it works for me<BR/>it just does xxAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15047696858755347818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-23376622397684217232009-03-19T03:56:00.000-07:002009-03-19T03:56:00.000-07:00Not always,Snow.I had a severe crisis of faith som...Not always,Snow.<BR/>I had a severe crisis of faith some years ago, which almost cost me my life.<BR/>In truth, I just don't know what to believe, but in order to keep going for my kids, I choose to believe there is benevolence.Nataliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12919764140075852854noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-68732494205798868972009-03-18T12:04:00.000-07:002009-03-18T12:04:00.000-07:00Joe, my congratulations to Calvin. I suppose he wa...Joe, my congratulations to Calvin. I suppose he wasn't the first to preach predestination, but he is certainly the best known.<BR/><BR/>I don't know if Joanne is online. I do know she's swamped with volunteer activities. I saw her last night with a little green derby and a green lai (sp?). She looked awfully cute.<BR/><BR/>"...many people opt out, never having had the chance to form a true, informed opinion about so many aspects of religion."<BR/><BR/>Yes, and what might they think if they read the following:<BR/><BR/>"When two men are fighting and the wife of one of them intervenes to drag her husband clear of his opponent, if she puts out her hand and catches hold of the man by the genitals, you must cut off her hand and show her no mercy." Deuteronomy 28: 11-12.<BR/><BR/>You've just got to wonder how often this was a problem. The Mosaic law contain scores of pages, not hundreds or thousands, yet it contains some of things that's it hard to imagine happening much if ever.<BR/><BR/>In another place, it says that if a soldier has a wet-dream that he has to leave camp until sunset the next day. Then there is the law about having your children stoned if they're disobedient; men taking their brother's widows for their own wives (and what is to be done to them if they refuse). Deuteronomy is really quite a read.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-50166318071400948042009-03-18T07:20:00.000-07:002009-03-18T07:20:00.000-07:00"Most churches are like political parties in that ..."Most churches are like political parties in that you only belong if you believe the same things that everyone else believes." This has always been my problem and especially with the Catholic church that doesn't even recognise my 20 year marraige (I'm Church of England and hubby's Catholic. I think that's why so many people opt out, never having had the chance to form a true, informed opinion about so many aspects of religion - myself included. Joanne sounds great, I think you should persuade her to start a blog!Reasonshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03070633072307321162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-73489036842692330302009-03-18T04:10:00.000-07:002009-03-18T04:10:00.000-07:00John Calvin is Turning 500! July 10th for what it...John Calvin is Turning 500! <BR/>July 10th for what it's worthJoe Toddhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07960458164425338569noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-60309262352808491872009-03-17T16:42:00.000-07:002009-03-17T16:42:00.000-07:00I agree with Reuben and will declare myself the st...I agree with Reuben and will declare myself the strangest of us.<BR/><BR/>You're going to be fine Snow, hang in there.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16813508472498593787noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-84303627592747148432009-03-17T15:57:00.000-07:002009-03-17T15:57:00.000-07:00Bill, Paul came from a highly regimented, black-or...Bill, Paul came from a highly regimented, black-or-white background, and my impression is that he tried to reproduce that in the rapidly growing church. I can see the last 2,000 years of church structure starting with him rather than with Jesus--or Peter. Does that make sense?<BR/><BR/>Thanks Reuben. Do you have any impression regarding WHICH of us is stranger?<BR/><BR/>Audrey, refuge is the right word, at least for me.<BR/><BR/>Natalie, you do, however, believe in a spirit world and in a universe that is basically benevolent, and this is where you and I differ. Is this not correct?Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-49936034692539355552009-03-17T15:04:00.000-07:002009-03-17T15:04:00.000-07:00That was a beautiful post, thanks for sharing your...That was a beautiful post, thanks for sharing your special experiences with Joanne and the gang.<BR/>I think I fall in to the same category as yourself. I enjoy church when I can, and don't go when I can't.I definitely believe there is something 'out there' but I don't think it is an old guy sitting on a cloud.xxNataliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12919764140075852854noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23830899.post-13333528674311910442009-03-17T12:54:00.000-07:002009-03-17T12:54:00.000-07:00Intersting. There are as many stories about the ch...Intersting. There are as many stories about the church as there are congregants! Each persons relationship to the church is different and personal. Yet for most of us, the common denominator seems to be that it is a place where, for whatever reasons, we seek refuge.<BR/>Lots of food for thought in this one.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com