Upon an esteemed relative who voted for Trump

Al is an evangelical Christian of unwavering integrity, kindness, and noblesse oblige. The worst thing I can say about him—indeed, the only bad thing that I could have said about him prior to the recent election in which he voted for Donald Trump—is that he allows no one to become intimate with him. If this were different, perhaps he and I could talk about his vote, my desire being to understand what would motivate a man who takes ethics seriously to vote for someone who wouldn’t recognize honor or decency if he tripped over it.

For instance, Al is humble; Trump is a braggart (“I’m, like, a really smart person”) Al is mannerly; Trump’s a boor. Al believes that people should be treated equally; Trump mocks the disabled and his contempt for Hispanics, Moslems, women, and black people, has earned him the loyalty of Nazis. Al is generous; Trump gives nothing to charity, and spends money that others donate to his own charity on himself. Al assumes personal responsibility; Trump blames others for his failures. Al has no interest in wealth; the greed of Trump and his family is insatiable (his daughter tried to sell the bracelet she wore on 60 Minutes). Al dresses modestly, lives in a modest house, and drives a modest car; Trump writes his name in block letters and is enamored of resorts, limousines, gold-plate, and a Boeing 757 with his name writ large on the fuselage. Al treats women as equals; Trump called his own daughter a “piece of ass,” and admitted to grabbing women by their crotches (when the women confirmed it, he threatened to sue them for defamation). Al pays his bills; Trump is a cheat who has declared bankruptcy four times, and promises to run the country like he runs his businesses. Al tells the truth; Trump lies as readily as he breathes and says that the press is composed of “deceitful, dishonest, liars” when they ask about it.

“Believe me,” Trump says about all manner of things, and his followers obediently believe him, evidence be damned. Global warming is a Chinese conspiracy, he says. He would have won the popular election had Hillary not arranged for three million illegals to vote, he says. The crime rate is exploding; the economy is in shambles; I saw thousands of Moslems cheering when the Twin Towers fell; all twelve of America’s intelligence agencies are lying about Putin having helped him win the election (he asked for Putin’s help); America is the most heavily taxed nation on earth; our employment rate is 42%; we can end gun violence by selling more guns to more people; and on and on and on. Why would anyone with even half a brain believe lies that are completely unsubstantiated or contradict known facts? Al is awfully old, so maybe he’s becoming senile…

To answer this question for the majority of Trump supporters, consider who voted for Trump. His supporters were primarily poorly educated Christians whose religion claims that it’s a virtue to believe physically impossible and glaringly contradictory claims about God, so isn’t it conceivable that they might taken the same approach with a demigod named Trump (just as Jesus claimed to be the only savior of their souls, Trump says he’s the only one who can save their physical bodies from terrorists). In any event, in determining which politicians to support, they place the bulk of their considerable store of credulity at the behest of males who are angry, charismatic, macho, and avowedly Christian, although the Christ in whom they believe is more akin to the scornful, intimidating, self-congratulatory, and perpetually angry Fox talk show host, Bill O’Reilly, than the soft-spoken Christ of the Bible. Such Americans mistake anger for strength because they are themselves frightened people who feel weak except when they’re angry, so serves Trump
well to inflame their anger, and by so doing negate what little intelligence they possess.

Maybe this is why it doesn’t seem to phase Trump supporters that tens of thousands of voting station attendants and government officials would have had to secretly conspire to enable three-million illegal immigrants to vote for Clinton (which just happens to be the amount by which Trump lost the popular vote). Likewise, if an alt-right website tells them that Hillary Clinton is running a child sex-trafficking ring out of a D.C. pizza parlor, the “news” goes viral, the owner receives hundreds of death threats, and a North Carolina man walks into the parlor firing his AR-15. Clinton characterized Trump supporters well when she said that half of them are a “basket of deplorables” and added, “I am sick and tired of the negative, dark, divisive, dangerous vision and the anger of people who support Donald Trump.” Indeed, these are frightening people who adore a mean-spirited psychopath who encourages their own meanness.

The only surprise about such people is that there are so many of them, it being not at all surprising that their numbers are greatest where the control of the Christian religion is greatest. When Trump bragged that he could murder someone on a Manhattan street in broad daylight and still be elected, it wasn’t meant as a compliment to the mental capacity of his followers. Like Hitler, he has gone from being a joke to being taken only too seriously, and like Hitler, a man who mocks the disabled or declares a judge unfit based upon his ancestry is well on his way toward building camps and handing out yellow stars. Such is the man for whom Al voted. Gentle Al, modest Al, reasonable Al, voted for a loud-mouthed demagogue who encourages violence and criminality to the point of offering to pay the legal expenses of those who are assaulting his enemies. Again, the only explanation I can offer for Al’s choice is that he is beginning to show signs of age-related credulity. I say this because, although I posit religion as one explanation, how can religion alone explain why a kindly and ethical man would vote for a vicious and unethical candidate? After all, it
’s not uncommon for people to be superior to their deity.

Another puzzler is why would the very regions of the country that are the most prone to flag-waving and support for military intervention in the (supposed) defense of the Bill of Rights, vote for someone who promises an end to the freedoms listed in the Bill of Rights with the exception of “the freedom to keep and bear arms,” which means more to Trump’s disciples than all of the other freedoms put together. Maybe this is because, without their guns, life is just too scary to contemplate. As for the other freedoms, take the freedoms of speech and of religion, for example. The only speech or religion that Trump
’s supporters appear to value is their own as can be seen in the constant barrage of death threats they levy against anyone who angers them (gays, liberals, Moslems, journalists, etc.) Then there’s the freedom from government persecution—which they define as the government’s efforts to secure equal rights for anyone they dislike. When Catholics and evangelicals speak of freedom, what the mass of them have in mind is the freedom to force everyone else to either pretend to believe like they do or face persecution if they refuse, and Trump is on their side.

Trump and his followers hold their
government in contempt simply because they haven’t been able to use it, to the extent that they would like, to force the rest of us to kowtow unto them, so it’s no surprise that he has appointed his billionaire confederates to head the very agencies that those confederates are pledged to destroy. This is but one of endless examples of Trump using the system to destroy itself, but since he won the election by appealing to the worst instincts of his supporters, it’s no surprise when they support such acts of bad faith. Still, the world of Republican politics contains numerous surprises.

For instance, Trump’s supporters insist that people like myself are being unfair to our soon to be president by our unwillingness to “give him a chance,” advice that strikes me as on a par with suggesting that a parent give a child molester the chance to babysit. But the greatest surprise of all is that the very people who are the most harmed by conservative policies are the same people who voted for Trump. They are poor in money (many hold minimum wage jobs, and the Republican Party opposes any floor to what they can be paid), poor in education, poor in opportunity, unable to afford medical insurance much less medical bills, and many of them live in states that receive more from the government in social programs than what they pay into it in taxes.

If anyone needs government help, it’s these people, but they hate being reminded of their inadequacies, but, more importantly, they hold that the Republican Party is on God’s side (or, perhaps, that God is on its side
). To whit, the Republican Party (or, at the very least, numerous Republican politicians): denies evolution, the Big Bang, global warming, the 4.5-billion-year age of the earth (which is inconsistent with Biblical genealogies), and all other scientific discoveries that are inconsistent with a literal interpretation of the Bible. It wants Old Testament “science” taught in schools; opposes abortion if not birth control; claims that stem cell research violates God’s law; favors “trickle down economics” (the belief that the rich are our friends, and the richer they are, the more they can help us by hiring); prefers a theocratic oligarchy to a democracy; wants to bankrupt the public school system by diverting tax money to religious schools; and supports the oppression of everyone who doesn’t look and think like a white, Bible Belt, Protestant Republican (it’s a fiction to imagine that Protestants who despise other Protestants are really tolerant of Catholics whose church they refer to as the Whore of Babylon). 

As many, if not most, of Trump’s people see the world, they are God’s chosen, and both they and God hate everyone who doesn’t look and think like they do. When they chant “Make America Great Again” their vision is a return to September 1929, when things were indeed good for what they would call “real Americans,” and who better to lead them into the past than the man who built New Jersey’s Taj Mahal, and then stiffed everyone who was naive enough to think they were going to get paid? Of course, when Trump-inspired disasters come to America, Trump will do as he always does, which is to deny responsibility. “Believe me,” he will say, “Hillary Clinton was behind this,” and his followers will no more think to doubt him than they would think to doubt Old Testament science because, after all, their reasons for trusting in the best thinking of the Bronze Age are on an equal foundation with trusting in a president who appeals to the same kind of thinking that surfaced in the formerly tolerant nation of 1920s Germany.

One of my friends said that what I need in regard to the apotheosis of Donald Trump is a hefty dose of love and tolerance, but at the risk of sounding as angry as a Trump supporter, I say love and tolerance be damned because they look too much like
acquiescence. When a five-year-old is at the wheel of the car, a good bit more than love and tolerance is required, and so it is now that Trump and followers are running the country. Nothing but disaster is going to come from these people, and, I fear, there will be violence on the part of those who oppose them. I say this because America only respects two things: wealth (America has been an oligarchy for years) and violence, and while few people have Trump’s billions, anyone can get an assault rifle. As for those of us who have no wealth and no stomach for violence, we can but hope that we will still have a country in the year 2021 when Trump’s four years are up—and that’s assuming that he hasn’t amassed enough power to hold onto the presidency in the manner of the Congo’s Joseph Kabila. One of the things I’ve observed about power is that those who assume it usually do so for selfish reasons, and that they have neither the wisdom to use it for the good of others, nor the willingness to relinquish it unless forced to do so.


kylie said...

I also know a sweet young Christian woman who is modest, honest, hard working....all the good qualities, but voted Trump on the basis that he will "make America great again"
I dont understand it at all. I do believe that he has picked up some of the Christian vote on the basis of his "pro-life" stance.
Trump has proven who he is and what his values are over and over again but still people are listening to his words.

I pray for America (and the rest of us) every day. I know it doesn't sound much but it is all I can do.

Emma Springfield said...

You have written a strong and valid statement. One other thing that concerns me is the number of military leaders he is surrounding himself with. Dictators surround themselves with soldiers and military minds. I accept that Mr Trump won the election. That does not mean that I have to like it. And "believe me" I will be keeping my eyes on what happens next.

Charles Gramlich said...

It may be that the same kinds of reasons why I left religion and could not stand Trump are the very ones that allowed those who remain in religion to vote for him. The hypocrisy of so much religion, although certainly not all, was a troubling factor for me, but many who have remained religious are not hypocrites themselves but seem to forgive and tolerate the ones among them. The very ability to believe completely contradictory ideas may be another factor. I foolishly believed initially that Trump would loose the religious people immediately because of his clearly non-Christian behaviors. I was horribly mistaken, embarrassingly so. I would love to know why. I don't.

stephen Hayes said...

Trump is about to screw over the very people he professes to support. I have no idea why Christians would vote for Trump since he defies everything Jesus supposedly stands for.

Elephant's Child said...

From this side of the world I am watching in horror. And in fear. And sadly some of our own politicians are rejoicing at Trump's success. They scare me too.

Kranhu said...

"The media took Trump literally but not seriously. His supporters took him seriously but not literally." I would say the people I know, 50% voted HRC and the other 50% voted mostly for Trump

joared said...

You summed up pretty well here. We must make an all,out effort in two years to carefully select who we send to House ans Senate. Despite DT's statements about votes he would have captured, he received less than most of the popular vote -- reminding him & all that he did not receive a mandate.

angela said...

Unfortunately the world is primed for another hitler
People are struggling, they are afraid for their safety
And as alsways they want someone to blame
So fear and hatred is feed by lies and propaganda and a
Messiah is then brought out and everyone is told that this person will safe us all
Humanity is repeating a bloody and dark history and I am so very frightened and upset at what I can see happening

Mir Stella said...

So many people voted against Hilary, but their choices were so ridiculously limited. What a world we live in!!

Strayer said...

Those I know who voted for Trump are few but two in particular have now clammed up, will not speak of him, and if I ask them, are you still happy with your candidate, they don't respond, just have a look of terrible unease and discomfort. I think many of them now wonder what they have done and are hoping he does not destroy the country or cause Americans massive suffering.

Tom said...

I too am flummoxed by the whole Trump phenomenon. I couldn't believe he won the nomination, and I would have bet my entire fortune (ha ha) that he wouldn't win the election. I of course did not vote for him, but I do not buy the explanation that he was put into office solely by poor uneducated Christians. Something else is going on. I don't know what it is -- I wish I did -- but it goes beyond the notion that his followers are too stupid to know what's good for them.

Snowbrush said...

“I do believe that he has picked up some of the Christian vote on the basis of his "pro-life" stance.”

Indeed, many Americans are one issue voters in that they won’t vote for anyone who doesn’t think as they do about abortion no matter what he or she thinks about other the issues they feel strongly about. Trump used to be strongly pro-abortion, and since he has given no reason for becoming just as strongly anti-abortion, I assume he did so in the interest of winning the election. He even went so far as to say that women who get abortions should be punished along with the doctors who provide them, but there was such an outcry that he reversed his position later that day. When it comes to upholding his own values, Trump is scarcely a brick wall in a tempest.

“You have written a strong and valid statement.”

Thank you. Your appreciation means a lot to me.

“I foolishly believed initially that Trump would loose the religious people immediately because of his clearly non-Christian behaviors. I was horribly mistaken, embarrassingly so. I would love to know why. I don’t.”

Jesus wasn’t always a model for tolerance or consistency either, but I cannot escape the observation that today’s dominant American religion reflects modern society’s ethics and concerns without regard for the teachings of Jesus. Clear Biblical prohibitions that would have gotten a person kicked out of a great many churches when you and I were kids (divorce and living together out of wedlock, for example) are considered to be either normal behavior for Christians today or, at the very worst, peccadillos, while these same people will go to battle over supposedly Christian values—abortion for one—that aren’t even mentioned in the Bible. As Jesus said, “They practice a form of religion but ignore its heart.” I don’t know how millions of Christians can read I Corinthians 13 or the Sermon on the Mount and go away believing that Jesus was a militarist who opposed abortion, promised material prosperity to the faithful, and expects the faithful to vote for a grossly immoral candidate like Trump, but they do. However, I do recall a “Christianity Today” article that spelled out why Trump should be considered a fool according to the Biblical requirements for such as designation.

Snowbrush said...

“I have no idea why Christians would vote for Trump since he defies everything Jesus supposedly stands for.”

God but do I ever torture myself over that question. I just know that even in Mississippi (where I grew up) religion wasn’t always politicized. I cannot even consider denominations like the Southern Baptist to still be Christian. As the Bible says, “By their fruits, you will know them,” and what are the fruits of Catholicism and evangelicalism other than callousness, intolerance, authoritarianism and hatred? I guess you heard that, despite the pope’s censure of big multinationals, the Vatican is now opening a McDonalds. The present pope does nothing more than put a smiling face on the same old Catholicism. The thing that bothers me most about him is his statements regarding how honorable and forthcoming the Catholic Church in America has been about pedophile priests, when the reality is that the getting information from the church has been like pulling teeth from a mountain lion who’s wide awake and in a very foul mood.

“sadly some of our own politicians are rejoicing at Trump's success. They scare me too.”

Could things down there be like I described them in response to the next comment regarding how urban states versus rural states vote?

“I would say the people I know, 50% voted HRC and the other 50% voted mostly for Trump”

Sometimes I wonder what I would do if I were looking for someplace to move, that is would I consider living in a Red State. I imagine that I know the mentality too well, and I don’t think I could bear it. However, even some Red States have Blue areas (Texas has its Austin and North Carolina its Chapel Hill), and some Blue States (Oregon, for example) have Red areas (geographically, most of Oregon is Red, but the heavily populated Willamette Valley is Blue), so there is also that to consider. It always seems odd to me that where the scenery is the most beautiful and the people the most rural (and therefore, presumably, the most close to nature), they vote for candidates who are only too happy to destroy nature in the interest of profit. The environment simply doesn’t rate that high on rural America’s list of values, maybe because rural Americans tend to be poor.

Snowbrush said...

“Despite DT's statements about votes he would have captured, he received less than most of the popular vote -- reminding him & all that he did not receive a mandate.”

I am often left wondering how much of what Trump says, he believes. About the election outcome, he’s said two things: one is he would have won the popular vote had not the election been rigged, and the other is he would have won the popular vote had it been expedient for him to campaign more in some of the states that he lost.

“a Messiah is then brought out and everyone is told that this person will safe us all”

You’re in Australia, so I never know how much non-Americans know about the details of American politics, but I associate two statements with Trump more than all others. “Believe me,” and, “I will make you safe.” If I don’t think about what’s behind such statements, they sound comforting, but if I do think about what’s behind them, they’re insulting to the intelligence. For instance, why should anyone believe statements that he offers no reason to believe, and how can he possibly make us safe from terrorists who aren’t even on the intelligence community’s radar?

“So many people voted against Hilary, but their choices were so ridiculously limited.”

I voted for Stein because I knew that Oregon would go Blue no matter how I voted, but I couldn’t understand the degree of hatred for Clinton, and I would have voted for her had I lived in a state where my vote would have mattered. I can’t stand her either, but to hate her enough to believe that she’s running a child prostitution ring! I wish I had numbers regarding how many Trump people are really so far gone into conspiracy theories that they believed that one. I think the people who voted for him as a protest against Clinton surely didn’t believe it, but I wouldn’t put anything past the rest of them because they did, after all, vote for Trump because they believed in Trump, and had little if any problem with his weirdness.

“I think many of them now wonder what they have done and are hoping he does not destroy the country or cause Americans massive suffering.”

I’ve wondered if there is much buyer’s remorse going on, but since he’s really not acting anymore bizarre now than during the election, why would people be turning against him. As I see it, they got what they paid for.

“I do not buy the explanation that he was put into office solely by poor uneducated Christians.”

There was also the Rust Belt, but the fact remains that where religion dominates, Trump won, and where religion has less of a hold, Clinton won, and that there is a demonstrably strong link between authoritarian religion and authoritarian politics based upon the fact that such people can’t tolerate uncertainty or gray areas. Still, not all Christians are poorly educated, and many Christians are liberals—or even conservatives—and were appalled by the evangelical and Catholic support of Trump. All I can say is that I wrote as I did based upon: maps of Red State voting versus Blue State voting; surveys regarding how the majority of America’s religious people think; and my long knowledge of religious people, and Bible Belt religious people in particular. They voted for the devil because the devil claimed to support their values regarding the things I listed in this post. But did they alone control the outcome of the election? I believe so, but I will grant you that there are a lot of fascists, gun-toters, racists, and homophobes who aren’t religious.

Elephant's Child said...

“sadly some of our own politicians are rejoicing at Trump's success. They scare me too.”

Could things down there be like I described them in response to the next comment regarding how urban states versus rural states vote?

I don't think so. There is an element of that, but one of the most vocal of his supporter amongst our politicians is urban and represents an urban electorate. He is however deeply religious. And like Trump, decidedly inconsistent about which of the commandments he upholds. And hown he choses to uphold them. Shafting the poor in favour of the interests of the rich is a given.

Snowbrush said...

“…one of the most vocal of his supporter amongst our politicians is urban and represents an urban electorate. He is however deeply religious. And like Trump, decidedly inconsistent about which of the commandments he upholds.”

Trump is from NYC, and as for upholding the so-called “Law of God,” I have no thought that Trump would know the Ten Commandments from the ten-article Bill of Rights. Maybe I should mention that the Bill of Rights was passed in 1791—two years after the Constitution—and is regarded as amendments to the Constitution, and therefore as parts of the Constitution. The purpose of the Bill of Rights was the protection of what the Founding Fathers considered non-negotiable rights and freedoms. The first truly troubling thing that I heard Trump say during his campaign was that the freedoms guaranteed by the Bill of Rights would have to be weakened in the interest of safety from terrorism. He would have no right to do this, but at least two other presidents have done it and gotten away with doing so, but only in the context of war.

The problem with the so-called “War on Terrorism” is that it’s an undeclared war against an undefined enemy, and there is no way to know when it’s over. Therefore any curtailing of the Bill of Rights would be not only illegal but open-ended. As I see it, it would be the abolishment of the ideals that America stands for, at least in our Founding Documents. Trump’s statement about the Bill of Rights was the first of numerous things he said I felt certain would eliminate him from serious consideration as a candidate for president, but it instead strengthened his candidacy because terrified people took it to mean that he would be “tough on terrorism,” yet it’s these very people (meaning Republicans) who are most prone to flag-waving; to obnoxiously chanting “USA, USA”; and who are the first to get weepy eyed when talking about “all those great Americans who have died in defense of our freedoms.” Based upon how vigorously they try to deny freedom to everyone but themselves, I never really believed that all of those patriotic types meant what they said in honoring their country’s freedoms, and when I realized how easily they could be persuaded to betray those freedoms in the face of a relatively minor threat, my mistrust was confirmed. I think that the leadership of the Republican Party is primarily interested in two things: forcing their religion and morality on everyone else, and in making the rich richer no matter what the cost to anyone else (based upon their policies, sick people could be dying in the street for all they cared—how many countries do you know of in which a child’s cancer treatment has to be paid with through a charity-promoted pizza night?). Although I’m not fond of the Democrats either, I would like to simply regard Republicans as the “honorable opposition,” but I regard them as anything but honorable.

Jennifer Rose said...

Well written.

I'm actually waiting to hear of the start of civil war. some people think this is an over reaction, but something is going to snap. Some if not a lot of the people that voted for Trump are going to be very angry when they see him not doing anything he said he would or they realize how much of an idiot he is. The really scary thing is, if he actually does manage to follow through with the things he "promised". the country is already split enough without him wanting to split it more. bring people together, don't cause more hate.

Kranhu said...

There is no buyer's remorse with people I know who voted for Trump. Most are counting the days until he is POTUS. I watched several Youtube thank you rallies he had. I am fascinated by his winning the election.

Sue in Italia/In the Land Of Cancer said...

Sadly everything you have written is all so true. Of course his electorate are the very people that will be hurt most (aside from the minorities and foreign born)by his policies. Will they ever have voter's remorse? No. Somehow the responsibility for the failed policies will slide right off of Teflon Trump.

Very scary times ahead.

I do admire your ability to put my angst into words.

Snowbrush said...

First, to a crucial matter: what to do with old Xmas cards. I make mine into bookmarks. I use a paper cutter, and cut them to center the “pretty” part of the card. I make every card the same size because it’s easier to sort through them that way. I’ve been doing this for years, so I have a large supply of beautiful bookmarks, so no more having to stuff scrap paper—or toilet paper—in books. Secondly, Peggy and I watched Sacha Cohen’s new movie, “The Brothers Grimsby” last night. If you like Sacha Cohen, you’ll probably do as I did and laugh so much that your throat and torso will be sore the next day, but if you don’t like Sacha Cohen, well, it might give you doubts about my taste if not my sanity that I enjoyed it. Even so, I liked much of his earlier work even better—especially Borat. If I regard a movie as so funny that I use half a box of Kleenex to wipe my eyes, and end up rolling about on the floor unable to breathe, that movie will have my highest rating. I’ve never found anyone as funny as Sacha Cohen.

“bring people together, don't cause more hate.”

I don’t know how anyone can do that at this point. “Togetherness” has been hindered through two Obama administrations by an obstructionist Congress that is so extreme that it is willing to block consideration of a new Supreme Court justice for a year. It is a Congress that regards any compromise as weakness, and is willing to put the government into default if it doesn’t get its way, even in regard to such symbolic issues as Planned Parenthood. However, Republicans are in control now, so unless Trump and Congress can’t get along, I suppose they can do whatever they think best, although it certainly won’t bring people together. Maybe it will alienate people sufficiently for them to elect a new Congress. Clearly, there is no “working with” Republicans, who I regard, with no exaggeration, as an existential threat to the nation.

“There is no buyer's remorse with people I know who voted for Trump.”

I don’t personally know any area Trump voters who have admitted voting for Trump—the Willamette Valley being a place where many people wouldn’t admit it—but then I don’t tend to see all that many people, so all I have to go by is that no one has defended him—or, as would be more likely—attacked me, regarding this post, something that I fully expected to happen based upon responses to my last post about Trump, which was a lot milder in tone than this one.

“Of course his electorate are the very people that will be hurt most (aside from the minorities and foreign born) by his policies.”

11.3 million people are already signed-up for Obama care for 2017, and what’s going to happen to those people when the Republicans abolish their insurance and offer nothing in its place? Peggy was on Obamacare for a year before she started Medicare, and we loved it. It cut her insurance premiums by such a huge amount that if she had been an unemployed person or an employed person with no workplace insurance, and had been without Obamacare, and unable to qualify for Medicaid, she simply wouldn’t have had insurance. All I’ve heard Trump offer is a thousand dollar tax rebate with which to buy private insurance, but that wouldn’t begin to pay for private insurance. And then he’s also likely to do away with some of the protections provided by Obamacare, such as coverage for pre-existing conditions. The Republicans are playing with people’s lives here, and neither they nor their supporters care, although it will be many of those supporters who will be screwed.

G. B. Miller said...

To use a very tired phrase, "It's the economy stupid."

And a very distinct loathing of the Nanny State. I don't know about you, but I don't like being told by the guv'ment that you need to do this (buy health insurance) or you need to do that (pay more taxes so that the millennials can sit on their ass and do nothing, or have illegals get all the benefits that natives and/or legal immigrants have rightfully earned.

possum said...

Well, my ex and I split up again(3rd time's the charm, right?) the day after the election when he admitted he voted for the Orange Julius, also known as el Pendejo by my Hispanic friends here. Why did Russ vote for the DT? He can not stand the idea of a woman being president, plain and simple. Russ is in his 80s, does not have a college degree, has always been with women who made more than he, owned their own homes, etc. He was a nice guy, but spent 8 years waiting for Obama to come knock on his door demanding he give up his guns and KNEW beyond a shadow of a doubt that Hillary would be pulling up in his yard before the year was out in a truck filled with confiscated guns after his.

But like your friend, he was otherwise reasonably intelligent and nice.
But when he admitted he voted for Trump, I was finished. Even I have my limits!

possum said...

Oh, one more thing - in reality, Trump's Billions are mostly billions in debt. I think you will soon find he has his name on stuff, but is in debt over his orange hair.
He still has not paid the workers who built the Trump bldg. in DC. Like the other workers that he owes money to - they are now trying to sue to get paid.
Good luck with that. This is where he usually declares bankruptcy and walks away telling the world that's smart business - like paying no taxes for over 20 years.

Snowbrush said...

"I don't like being told by the guv'ment that you need to do this (buy health insurance) or you need to do that (pay more taxes so that the millennials can sit on their ass and do nothing”

Are you saying that you so love freedom that you voted for a man who promised to limit your Constitutionally guaranteed freedoms, the very freedoms that so many Americans have died to defend? Unless you’re a libertarian, it’s likely that you also favor telling women they can’t get abortions, telling transgender people which bathroom they have to use, telling homosexuals they can’t get married, forcing non-Christians to endure--and even pay for--Christian monuments and religious observances on government buildings and at government functions, and so forth. I could write a book about our differences because we, as you very well know, are so divided that it’s unlikely that anything short of an outside threat to us both would bring us together. The older I get, the more I lean toward democratic socialism, by contrast with which the conservative solution to all of our problems is, as I understand it: drastically deregulate banking, the stock market, and so on down the line to small ranchers and auto repair shops; drastically reduce and/or privatize the size and functions of government; turn public lands over to the states to dispose of as they see fit; exploit nature without restriction and without regard for the environment or the welfare of future generations; make military spending our top priority; allow those who can’t afford to pay for food, housing, and medical care to go without; so weigh the legal and economic scales in the favor the rich that the rest of us will be reduced to modern-day serfs. I don’t see anything that Republicans favor as other simplistic, short-term, exploitative, and without compassion.

“But when he admitted he voted for Trump, I was finished.”

Goodness! I can’t imagine being married to a Trump supporter. It’s not that I was crazy about Clinton (I voted Green), but to so hate Clinton as to vote for Trump seemed to me like hacking your leg off because you had an ingrained toenail!

Trump's Billions are mostly billions in debt.”

Can you imagine what Trump supporters would have said had Clinton asked Russia to hack into the IRS and release his tax returns? Yet, they’re apparently fine with him asking Putin to hack her, and they’re fine—the day after his meeting with the nation’s intelligence agencies regarding Russian interference with the election—with him continuing to encourage close ties with the Russians and saying that anyone who doesn’t share his desire is either stupid or a fool. Something stinks about his warmth for Putin. Surely, either he has a financial incentive or he’s being blackmailed.

Snowbrush said...

G.B. if you Google "Trump and the Bill of Rights," or "How Trump would restrict freedom," etc. you'll find many instances of him expressing a desire to abandon the Bill of Rights in the interest of security or even of making money. Here is just one link containing segments of his various speeches in which he expresses, what is to me, an appalling contempt for freedom: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrqh8HWcMhE. So, when you express a hatred for the compulsive nature of what you call the "Nanny State," I wonder how it is that you, presumably, voted for a man who would compel you to give up much more basic freedoms.

All Consuming said...

Excellent reading dear, both in the post and in the comments. I've been back a few times, to read this and your other recent posts when able to sit down and rest and here - "I’ve wondered if there is much buyer’s remorse going on, but since he’s really not acting anymore bizarre now than during the election, why would people be turning against him. As I see it, they got what they paid for." - I think, and have read, tons of regret, because those who believed specific actions would be taken (on whatever theme they say meant a lot to them, usually migrants and Obamacare) are beginning to find out that he he might have said a few things purely in order to become President of the United Stattes. Who'd have thought that could be the case?!! Tsk. I'm with Sue, watching, horrified from the outside while the man who is taking over one of the most powerful stations in the world goes on Twitter everyday behaving like a spoilt uneducated child who likes to throws his toys out of the pram to get what he wants. Great choice.

Snowbrush said...

"I think, and have read, tons of regret, because those who believed specific actions would be taken (on whatever theme they say meant a lot to them"

It is a common saying here that "Liberals took Trump literally but not seriously, conservatives took him seriously but not literally," and this seems to be true.

You might have noticed that I no longer moderate comments, something I started prior to my two posts about Trump. When I put the first of them up, I wondered if I should go back to moderation, and I thought that well, if I'm cursed and threatened, it would only support my thesis about how dangerous Trump and his supporters are. While Republicans are telling us to "get over it," "be good sports," give him a chance," etc., I wonder if these people all fell on their heads when they were babies, because this isn't an occasion for anything but pure resistance, and I believe it will grow exponentially. I heard a public radio show yesterday (that went with a post of yours) about how we all need to remember to love one another and practice good listening skills, and I just thought that, well, sometimes love is better done from a distance, and as for listening there is nothing whatsoever that anyone could say to me that would make his or her support of a man like Trump understandable much less respectable. I don't mean to say that the goodness of a person's heart is necessarily tied to his politics or religion, but I hear enough on the radio about why people voted for Trump to know I am too alienated from them to discuss politics with them anymore than I would be open to discussing dogfighting with Michael Vick (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Vick), my firm belief being that there is no rational defense of either. You might point out that if anyone feels as I do, the country is irreconcilably divided. I don't believe this because I think that a Trump presidency will be so horrific that only the rabid right-wing will remain loyal to him and maybe not even them.

Anonymous said...

A very unsteady time we are seeing. I truly like your blog, dear Snowbrush. Each post deeply thought about and perfecting each thought. Yes, you are good. Whiz of an intellect (bow). I'll come again. How are those fur babies today? I wish for a cat but a passel of dogs dampens that desire.

Snowbrush said...

“I truly like your blog, dear Snowbrush”

Thank you. I can’t sleep tonight, and it gave me a good feeling to hear from you. For the first time in a long time, I woke up feeling that I’m going to be alright. For one thing, I can get a new narcotic prescription in two days (that’s always a cause for joy every month), and for another, I just switched from Lexapro to Zoloft. I like Zoloft, and had asked the doctor for it back in November, but he was set on the idea that I would like Lexapro even better? Well, after three months of increased dosages that made me so wired that he gave me tranquilizers to even out the Lexapro, I finally told him that I had had enough, and asked again for Zoloft, which I started on yesterday with high hopes.

“How are those fur babies today?”

The fur babies are a delight. Brewsky is our six year old, fourteen pound, usually gentle, gray and black tabby. Ollie is our our sensitive nine pound gray guy with white accents—he will be two this summer, and is handsome enough to be a GQ model. Scully is our assertive black and white tuxedo girl with brown eyes and white whiskers, and she will be one this summer. Peggy wanted them all to be lap cats, but has been disappointed until recently. Last night, Brewsky and Ollie sat in her lap at the same time, and all three like to cuddle with us—and with one another—in bed. We think about getting a dog, but figure a dog would ruin things with our cats, and we don’t need the responsibility anyway. Cats tie a person down in some of the same ways that dogs do, but not as much, so I’m content to just have cats, although I very much love and miss dogs. I don’t see getting a fourth cat though, and I even worry a little about whether we’re not too old to have gotten Scully. because if she lives to be 20, I’ll be eighty-eight, and I’m not sure I’m up to living that long. In any event, she will be out last kitten.

Tell me about your "passle." Do you feel that maybe you got carried away?

Joe Todd said...

Waste of time trying to talk with a Trump supporter has been my experience. Maybe after Trump is responsible for killing millions of people it will be different but I'm not sure of that,
Sorry to hear of your most recent health problems..Wishing you the best
Joe Todd